Follow-Up #2
In response to Comments 2&3 from "Christian Political Party?":
I could vote in favor of a nonresistant (= no war, no capital punishment, no violence against criminals) government, but I don't think nonresistance is a viable philosophy on which to run a country. I don't think it would accomplish the job it is here to do. God showed us (by the Mosaic Law) the way earthly kingdoms should run -- they have to use force to protect, or they will be over-run by selfish people from either the inside or the outside. (A government that refused to use force against Hitler's men would not have accomplished much.) Romans 13 indicates that earthly governments are ordained by God and that they should bear the sword against those who do evil. A nonresistant government does not seem to be in God's plan for the world.
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God ordained worldly governments to protect those who do good. If this protection is God-ordained, do I have reason to not take part in it? Am I a hypocrite to say that government should resist evil but that I as a Christian should not be a part of that resistive force? Am I spurning part of the truth of Romans 13?
As always, it is good to interpret a passage in light of the rest of the Bible. We don't have far to go from Romans 13 to accomplish that.
Whereas Romans 13:4b states: "for he [the ruler] is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil,"
Romans 12:19 states: "Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but [rather] give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance [is] mine; I will repay, saith the Lord."
Rulers of earthly kingdoms do and should avenge wrath. Christians should not avenge wrath. Killing may be delegated, but it will not be delegated to Christians.
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So God has established an institution that requires the existence of non-Christians? Doesn't God want all men to be saved?
Think of a government as an inorganic shell with no souls of men attached. That government can be filled by men who freely choose to not be Christians, and God can use their unfortunate choice to keep the world in order. If they all become Christians, the inorganic government shell will become empty. If a government is still necessary, I suppose God could employ angels or something. God doesn't require the presence of non-Christians, but will use them if they exist.
I could vote in favor of a nonresistant (= no war, no capital punishment, no violence against criminals) government, but I don't think nonresistance is a viable philosophy on which to run a country. I don't think it would accomplish the job it is here to do. God showed us (by the Mosaic Law) the way earthly kingdoms should run -- they have to use force to protect, or they will be over-run by selfish people from either the inside or the outside. (A government that refused to use force against Hitler's men would not have accomplished much.) Romans 13 indicates that earthly governments are ordained by God and that they should bear the sword against those who do evil. A nonresistant government does not seem to be in God's plan for the world.
God ordained worldly governments to protect those who do good. If this protection is God-ordained, do I have reason to not take part in it? Am I a hypocrite to say that government should resist evil but that I as a Christian should not be a part of that resistive force? Am I spurning part of the truth of Romans 13?
As always, it is good to interpret a passage in light of the rest of the Bible. We don't have far to go from Romans 13 to accomplish that.
Whereas Romans 13:4b states: "for he [the ruler] is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil,"
Romans 12:19 states: "Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but [rather] give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance [is] mine; I will repay, saith the Lord."
Rulers of earthly kingdoms do and should avenge wrath. Christians should not avenge wrath. Killing may be delegated, but it will not be delegated to Christians.
So God has established an institution that requires the existence of non-Christians? Doesn't God want all men to be saved?
Think of a government as an inorganic shell with no souls of men attached. That government can be filled by men who freely choose to not be Christians, and God can use their unfortunate choice to keep the world in order. If they all become Christians, the inorganic government shell will become empty. If a government is still necessary, I suppose God could employ angels or something. God doesn't require the presence of non-Christians, but will use them if they exist.
posted by Claire at 15:32
1 Comments:
Moving on from below, you here make the case that Christians are disallowed from taking part in the good, proper, and God-ordained mission of government.
This seems to me to rest on an immanetization of the kingdom of God.
That is, you seem to believe that Christians cannot take part in any earthly kingdom because of our obligations to God. This is ridiculous. Christ's kingdom is not of this world.
You further fail to make a distinction between public and private. Personal vengence is prohibited, but public is not. The military, the police, the courts, none of these avenge themselves, and that is what Christians are prohibited from.
You addressed this a bit in your other post, but were, to put it mildly, terribly unconvincing.
I'm too tired to launch into a long philosophical discussion at the moment, so I'll sign off for now.
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